Sunday, September 2, 2012
A Symbol of Hope
Editors Note: Amherst does fly the American flag on the Town Common and Police/Fire stations 24/7 365 days a year.
The town purchased "commemorative flags" (currently numbering 25) in the summer of 2001 using tax money assigned to the veterans department commemoration fund, and on the night of September 10, 2001 created a policy restricted them to only six occasions per year, one of which is Memorial Day.
The commemorative flags were allowed to fly on 9/11 on the first anniversary in 2002 and again in 2003 but not in 2004 thru 2009. Amherst Town Meeting in 2007 turned down my "advisory" article to the Select Board (as only the Select Board has authority over the public ways, so it's their call) by an astonishing two-thirds vote.
Under public pressure the Select Board in 2009 came up with a "compromise" based on the Town Meeting vote, saying that since one-third of Town Meeting supported the flags they can go up once every three years. So they flew in 2009.
Then in 2010 Select Board Chair Stephanie O'Keeffe (who voted in favor of the flags flying annually when she was a town meeting member) turned down my annual request and came up with another compromise only allowing the commemorative flags up every five years or what she called "milestone anniversaries".
Thus the commemorative flags flew in 2011 on the tenth anniversary and are currently not scheduled to fly again until 2016.
Thank You Larry,From a 59 years Amherst res. [Paul R.]
ReplyDeleteBeautiful Larry.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCWdCKPtnYE
at least the lady host pronounced our town correctly. :)
ReplyDeletethank you larry for so eloquently stating the case against the self-hating leftist element in amerst!
sunshine is the best disinfectant.
(amerst needs a lot of disinfectant)
~bill r.
We cannot win this argument about flying the flags on September 11 if you continue to argue it this way: by taking it to the American news outlet most committed long-term to distorting the motives and objectives of people who think and vote like me. They have no interest in context, nuance, perspective, accuracy, and it shows with their reporting here.
ReplyDeleteSo I am beginning to doubt your motives here. You seem to be more interested in drawing attention to yourself, from whatever source (you don't seem to care), and embarrassing the Town and its leaders, than in actually doing the persuasion necessary to carry the day.
I continue to believe that the flags flying on September 11 every year would commemorate something very important: the communitarian spirit that motivated hundreds of Americans to go back into the towers to save others, AND spurred a smaller, but equally courageous group of Americans to resist their captors and prevent a jet airliner from striking downtown Washington.
Rich Morse
Thank you Rich for expressing so well what I was thinking but was unable to put into words. I usually agree with nothing you say but in this we share common ground.
ReplyDeleteAnd that is pretty much exactly what I brought up.
ReplyDeleteRemember, CNN screwed up the story 11 years ago, saying the town was restricting the rights of private citizens to fly flags.
I believe Ms. O'Keeffe herself gave me plaudits for my speech to Town Meeting five years ago on this matter (covered in a fair and balanced way by Amherst Media) and look what that got me: a two thirds defeat, where if memory serves, you voted on my side.
Exactly where would you have me take this sad story?
Why do you have to take it anywhere?
ReplyDeletebecause it needs to be told.
ReplyDeleteTown officials have, apparently, not learned from history.
I'm willing to think that people's attitudes have changed and some people have changed their minds in that now they believe the flag should be flown on every 9/11.
ReplyDeleteIt's true that Larry never gives up (look at his anti LSSE crusade), but we can -- and the Select Board can -- ignore him.
If someone holds up a mirror that reflects something ugly, do not curse the mirror (or the guy holding it).
ReplyDelete"So I am beginning to doubt your motives here. You seem to be more interested in drawing attention to yourself, from whatever source (you don't seem to care), and embarrassing the Town and its leaders, than in actually doing the persuasion necessary to carry the day."
ReplyDeleteAww pwease puhhhh-weasssse fly the flags?
Rich, seriously?
As opposed to "you lefty idiots should be ashamed of yourselves"??
ReplyDeleteYes, seriously, Whoever You Are.
Do you not understand the importance of respectful persuasion in a democracy?
Mr. Kelley says that he has no alternative to this approach. He does: respecting the other point of view and working to change it. Scolding, shaming, holding people up to ridicule, beating one's chest in defiance, all will not work. I know that this is what Mr. Kelley loves to do, and he gets a fair amount of applause for it, especially outside Amherst, but he is shooting himself in the foot.
I believe, with him, that the flag is a more encompassing symbol than simply the masthead for the military-industrial complex.
Try Justice John Paul Stevens' spirited dissent in Texas v. Johnson, 491 U.S. 397 (1989), the flag-burning case, as a jumping off point. There's another way to present this. Are you looking to win or simply to square off with people?
Rich Morse
I've only just begun.
ReplyDelete"Mr. Kelley says that he has no alternative to this approach. He does: respecting the other point of view and working to change it. Scolding, shaming, holding people up to ridicule, beating one's chest in defiance, all will not work. I know that this is what Mr. Kelley loves to do, and he gets a fair amount of applause for it, especially outside Amherst, but he is shooting himself in the foot."
ReplyDeleteRich, don't be such a coward.
Really.
I happen to be a far left progressive democrat AND I think the town should fly the flags on 9/11 every year to honor all the innocent lives lost on that incredibly sad day.
ReplyDeleteThe right does not have a monopoly on patriotism or love of the flag.
Even in Amherst.
ReplyDeleteIn keeping Fox News's reputation for accuracy they misspelled John Musante's name.
ReplyDeleteMaybe the Town Manager will appear on the show next week. I'm sure they would get it correct on the second try.
ReplyDeleteMr. orse,
ReplyDeleteWhen I was an undergrad (at an institution Mr Kelley does not like), I planted American flags every anniversary.
I remember being told I was a corporate lapdog, an idiot, a supporter of the baby-killers, and a f***ot.
Mr. Kelley may be a bit blunt, but the one thing I learned about the town and schools of Amherst is that they do not preach what the practice. The supposed open-minded respect of the town only extended to those who held the same opinion of the town, and education and outreach attempts were often met with hostility. At a Israeli educational rally we had issues with town members shouting through megaphones and drowning us out; an item we were not allowed to have. Amherst doesn't practice "educational democracy," and after awhile you must fight fire with fire.
Mr. Kelley is exercising his free speech, and rightly so. I do not agree with him on 2/3 of the issues, but I respect his right and his efforts to make himself heard. And I know he will continue.
Very nice job on that interview! What can we (really meaning me) do to change this? I'm not very familiar with how this all works in Amherst. Thanks for any info. you can provide.
ReplyDeleteAlot of you hide behind the word anonymous. Step out from your cloak and show your real name. I'm proud of mine and you should be too. Those, that oppose having the flags raised for 9/11 surely are showing their true patriotism of this great country.Try searching your souls and "Think on These Things"
ReplyDeleteYou could drop the Select Board and town manager a civil note via email (selectboard@amherstma.gov, MusanteJ@amherstma.gov) saying you support flying the commemorative flags every 9/11, so we never ever forget that day.
ReplyDeleteAnd a generation from now, they don't forget.
I think this would happen in a heartbeat if someone other than Larry went before the Selectboard. Larry has made this about him winning when it's about the flags.
ReplyDeleteFine, then get your butt in front of them next Monday and ask ever so nicely.
ReplyDeleteWe were in NYC on 9/11. Within hours, in towns surrounding NY (and perhaps around the US), flags quietly appeared on homes, in apartment windows, etc. They were everywhere. It was an amazing acknowledgement of our collective trauma, and of our connection to each other. I think it was more powerful than any official display.
ReplyDeleteWe have flown our flag every day since 9/11/01.
Well done Larry! There will always be haters like the above but we have to remember what matters to us! You are very passionate over the flag issue as I am but being a Shutesbury resident I have no voice in the matter!
ReplyDeleteI hope to see those flags flying this 9/11.
God Bless all the victims of 9/11.
Just wondering here:
ReplyDeleteIs this the same 9/11 attack that caused a republican president to invade Afghanistan and then leave there and invade Iraq?
And are these the same wars that the republicans are now blaming the democrat president for?
Fly the flags if that makes you happy, but it's the actual wars, the killing, the dying, the maimed, the permanent damage to ALL of the survivors that I'm interested in.
For all that you want to remember 9/11, I don't hear anyone here clamoring for recollection of everything America screwed up after that attack?
How many billions did we piss away in Iraq. Add that to the deaths and the ptsd.
But somehow, if we fly the flags in Amherst on 9/11, everything will be ok.
Hey Stratford,
ReplyDeleteBully for you cause you use your name. Go ahead and put yourself in the hall of fame.
I don't know who you are barking at because I don't see anyone here disagreeing with the idea that flags should be flown on 9/11?
If we all agree to that, can we also agree that Republicans are now running fast from the wars they started and blaming the current president for them?
Nice, move on their part, eh Stratford? Reminds me of teenagers. They want to be treated like adults but too often act like children.
Oh, but these wars don't really matter. The only thing that matters is remembering the 3,000 innocents in OUR country who were killed. Forget about the tens of thousands of innocent Iraqis we killed in revenge for something the Iraqis had nothing to do with.
But Kelley probably won't publish this because it strays from the laser focus he has on flags in Amherst.
Wrong. On all counts.
ReplyDeleteOften this blog is simply an inventory of hatreds.
ReplyDeleteAlways, nothing gets done here.
This is America. This is the American flag. Why should our country's flag on display be an issue at any time? Leave 'em up all year.
ReplyDeleteOn another subject: I remember growing up with the phrase ". . .without regard to race, color, creed, or religion." Seems that these days, that's all we do is regard those things. Pity.
And finally this: Diversity is a great thing. Especially diversity of thought.
I'm also grateful for Rich Morse's on-target comments, and I wish Larry would just drop this issue (especially the out-of-context, spiteful comments about members of the UMass faculty, with whom he seems to have axes to grind.
ReplyDeleteAt the same time, I think (and would propose) the commemorative flags could easily fly for a couple weeks between the Friday before Memorial Day and Flag Day (June 14), a couple more weeks starting the Friday before Labor Day, as well as on Independence Day ( July 4) and Veterans Day (November 11).
I'd be happy to push for that (again - I tried this very proposal when I was in a better position to make it happen, but got nowhere then - mainly because Larry's harassment of almost everyone made it impossible), if Larry would drop it this year, re-think the way he handles this (and so many other issues), and bring it up again cooperatively next spring.
-YF
I don't really understand the need for any of this. We are Americans unless we choose to opt out. This issue here seems to be what in the mind of the commenter does the flag stand for.
ReplyDeleteMy thought is this "freedom is not free" It is messy, dirty, filled with conflict, and takes hard work to keep.
Whether you are a bleeding heart liberal, a Reagan Republican, Ashamed of your country and the military industrial complex, a veteran of our armed services, or the many other labels we could give each other, we are all still Americans.
We should be proud of the country that lets us view our opinions for and against. If we feel shame for our past or present actions then we should work to correct it.
Don't take it out on the flag for it represents us all, the good the bad, and the ugly. If you don't like what you perceive the flag stands for then get up and make some change.
I have a better idea "YF" (God, you sound like Rob Kusner).
ReplyDeleteSelect Board allows the flags to fly next week on 9/11, and then they put on the Spring election ballot a non binding advisory question to the general public asking if the flags should fly every 9/11.
It seems to me Larry that you are beating your head against a brick wall (SB). To finally end/find a solution to this argument, why not create a petition, get the required voters signatures on the petition and put it up to vote next ballot ( should Amherst fly the flag on every 9/11 or every 5 year anniversary) Since the SOB's of the SB feel they can speak for all of "us", let's vote and see what happens. I'd like to see the 9/11 remembered every year just like all the other occasions, I don't think you and I are the only tax payers that feel this way....what say you Larry?
ReplyDeleteI'll ask the Select Board --ever so politely of course --to put it on the ballot this spring I think at this point they are looking for a way to gracefully exit the frying pan.
ReplyDeleteFrankly, from the comments here it doesn't sound like Amherst deserves to be allowed to fly the flag ever.
ReplyDeleteLarryK said...
ReplyDeleteI'll ask the Select Board --ever so politely of course --to put it on the ballot this spring I think at this point they are looking for a way to gracefully exit the frying pan.
Perhaps they should gracefully step down from their seats on the SB, so arrogant for them to speak for "us" and tell ppl this is what "we" desire. Their time in office is limited, I'm sure.....let's have the VOTE!
While I may not agree with her all of the time, I certainly do not want Ms. Stephanie to resign!! She keeps the rest of the SB in line and on task. At least they focus. And BTW, SOMEBODY elected them -- um, would that be the majority?
ReplyDeleteUm, not a single sitting Select Board member was elected in an election that garnered a 50 % turnout.
ReplyDeleteThe Amherst Chamber of Commerce and BID should fight to have the flags up for at least 2 weeks each September- For Labor Day, 9/11 as well as to welcome students, parents, tourists and shoppers to the downtown area.
ReplyDelete(how long are the holiday lights/ decorations allowed to stay up after the last recognized holiday?)
Doesn't the BID want the flags up for their block party?
The Select Board needs to choose their battles- this issue is not worth a fight!
Yeah, tthe town did put them up three years ago for the 250th Anniversary Parade.
ReplyDelete
ReplyDeleteSeptember 04, 2012
Select Board Chair Clarifies 9-11 Flag Display Issue
A statement by Select Boar Chair Stephanie O'Keeffe clarifying the 9-11 Flag Display Issue has been released.… Read on
http://www.amherstma.gov/civicalerts.aspx?AID=949
Yeah, she actually released that days ago on the Gazette and Republican news articles . Did not do much good. In tomorrow's Gazette she blames me for all the bad press.
ReplyDeleteWell, you didn't exactly mention on Fox News that Amherst actually flies the flag every single day. They gave the impression that Amherst doesn't fly the flag, which it does.
ReplyDeleteand of course, that paragon of journalism, Faux News, displays :
ReplyDeleteMA town won't fly American flag 9/11.
And 11 years ago CNN made the the same error
ReplyDeleteFreedom is far from free of cost. You who scoff at the flag under the blanket of freedom provided and maintained by those who make sacrifices greater than you can imagine amuse me. You were probably the leftist who burned the flag or spit on a soldier returning from battle. Try expressing the same views in other parts of the world. It would be as successfully a gesture as if you burned the flag in front of me.
ReplyDeleteFly the damn flags. Not in celebration, but in remberance of the day and for all of those who have served and suffered as a result.
The only easy day was yesterday.